Episode Transcript
[00:00:20] Speaker A: The Tudor History and Travel show is a podcast that brings Tudor history to life by exploring Tudor places and artefacts in the flesh.
You will be traveling through time with Sarah Morris, the Tudor Travel Guide, uncovering the stories behind some of the most amazing Tudor locations and objects in the uk.
Because when you visit a Tudor building, it is only time and not space which separates you from the past.
And now, over to your host, Sarah Morris.
[00:00:53] Speaker B: Hello, my time travelling friends, It's Sarah the Tudor Travel Guide, back with another episode of the Tudor History and Travel Show. And yes, so begins another year.
2026 rolls in and of course, I must say to you, a happy new year. I hope you've had a wonderful festive season.
Now, I've been working hard on pulling together the podcasts for this year and it's coming together nicely and so many interesting places that we'll be exploring together, some of which I have never even been to.
So that always sends a little bit of a tingle up my spine. I love going to new places.
There will be quite an emphasis on Henry VII and the men around him in 2026, largely because or in honor of the fact, of course, that I have now moved to Wales, the place of Henry's birth.
And I look forward to bringing the first of to you, hopefully in the spring.
But in the meantime, if you remember and if you tuned into our last podcast, at the end of last year, we were on the trail of Catherine of Aragon and in fact, we're in the middle of a three part series which really looks at the final few years of Catherine's life.
If you recall, in the last episode, we were exploring Buckton palace with Francis Farmer, our expert guide.
This was one of the places in which Catherine was exiled and of course, the place in which she had that famous showdown with Charles Brandon, Duke of Suffolk, who was trying to persuade her to move to a place that would be, in her opinion, more injurious to her health.
Catherine, of course, emerged victorious from that particular battle, but ultimately she was moved on to the second place and the focus of today's podcast, and that is Kimbolton Castle, which is also in Cambridgeshire.
As you will hear in this podcast, Kimbolton today is a private school and to all intents and purposes, there is very little left of the Tudor building.
But like many of these older houses, whilst the exterior paints the visage of a different era, some of the internal bones of the building still represent some of those earlier spaces.
And there is part of this building which lies upon and is occupied by some of Catherine's private rooms.
There are some great stories to tell here, too, because, of course, when Catherine of Aragon was around, there was always some drama in her wake.
And I look forward to bringing you those stories with today's expert guest, Andrew Bamford.
He'll be accompanying us on our journey in Time. Today on this, the anniversary of Catherine's death on the 7th of January, 1536, you will, as ever, find show notes that associate with this podcast. And there will be a link there to an earlier blog that I wrote specifically about Kimbolton. And we've appended some of the additional images that we took on our visit to Kimbolton on this occasion.
So, my friends, it is now time to buckle up. We are about to go time traveling.
So without further ado, ladies and gentlemen, I give you Kimbolton Castle.
[00:04:41] Speaker C: Welcome, dear listeners, to this, the second of three episodes in our series focusing on the final years of the life of Queen Catherine, Catherine of Aragon, after she was, of course, expelled from court by Henry VIII in 1531. Now, you will remember in the last episode, I was at Buckden palace in Cambridgeshire, which was one of the.
[00:05:07] Speaker D: The.
[00:05:08] Speaker C: Well, actually it was the third location she was exiled to, after the Moor and Amt Hill. And she spent around 10 months there before she was eventually, if you call, evicted on the orders of the king by Charles Brandon, Duke of Suffolk. Now, if you remember, she managed to avoid being evicted to Summersham Castle, but Charles Brandon, or I should say the king, finally got his way in May 1534, where she was brought here to Kimbolton Castle, also in Cambridgeshire. It lies about six miles away from Buckthen Palace. And so we're here today to explore the history of Kimbolton Castle and Catherine's time here, which many of you will know is one of the most important periods in her life, because it is here that Catherine died on the 7th of January, 1536.
Now, to help us unravel this fascinating period in Catherine's life, we have, of course, our expert guest, and I'd love to introduce Andrew. Andrew Bamford. Welcome to the show.
[00:06:16] Speaker D: Thank you very much.
[00:06:17] Speaker C: So, before we go on, as ever, as is tradition on this show, please do say a little bit about who you are and what you do here and your. Your links to Kimbolton Castle.
[00:06:26] Speaker D: Well, I'm the curator of Kimbolton Castle and I was formerly head of history here at Kimbolton school for over 30 years. So I've been associated with Kim bolton now for 41 years, but I haven't seen the ghost of Catherine yet.
[00:06:46] Speaker B: Maybe today.
[00:06:48] Speaker C: Maybe today. Oh, we've got a history teacher. Did I get my facts right?
Tick vg Gold star, I hope. Anyway, I'm not going to ask.
Good. Okay. So I always like to start with the big picture.
Folks who've been listening to this know that Cambridgeshire. Well, maybe you could just remind us where Cambridgeshire is and where Kimbolton is geographically for those people.
[00:07:15] Speaker D: Yes, well, in Cambridgeshire now, but he was in Huntingdonshire since up to 1974. So I was very keen on Huntingdonshire connections. And the key thing about Kimbolton, it's on the borders of three counties.
So one and a half miles south is Bedfordshire and two miles west is Northamptonshire. So we're on the board between Northamptonshire, Cambridgeshire and Bedfordshire.
[00:07:44] Speaker C: Right, okay. And we will, as I say, be coming and exploring in detail Catherine's story here. But I love finding out about the early history of these places. What was here for first? How did this place become a place of significance?
[00:08:01] Speaker D: Well, there was a Mott and Bailey castle built at the other end of the village to start with. But the, the most important year in Kim bolton's history is 1200 and that is when Jeffrey Fitzpiers got a license or charter to have a market in the, in the High Street. And that's why today you come to Kimbolton. We've got a very big wide High street. And he was a man of influence. So he had the road from Catworth to Bedford redirected to go through Kimbolton and the High street, as you see now, was put in at that time. The original road went round the back of the High street in what is now East Street. So that meant a lot more trade was actually going through Kimbolton and than otherwise would be the case. So it became much more of a little hub in this area of Huntingdonshire than it was beforehand.
[00:09:02] Speaker C: And it's a fine High street, I have to say.
[00:09:04] Speaker D: It is, it is. We're very proud of the, of the, of the High street and quite a few, although there are some Georgian fronting, most of the, the buildings are sort of medieval and quite, quite a lot of the houses in the High street would have been there when Catherine was at Kimbolton between 1534 and 1536 y.
[00:09:25] Speaker C: So you know, you come into Kimbolton and as it's very attractive little town. Do you call yourself a town?
[00:09:32] Speaker D: Yes, officially a town.
[00:09:33] Speaker C: It is officially a town. And at the top you can see Kimbolton Castle as it is today. You can't miss it if Catherine had been coming up that driveway in 1534, what would she have seen at the top of the driveway?
[00:09:47] Speaker D: Well, things were slightly different. I think the main entrance would be to our right and it would be. It was a. Essentially a double moated Tudor manor house. So perhaps to. To call it a castle sounds very grand, but it's very important to think that Kimbolton Castle is not Cambridge's answer to Warwick Castle.
So it is. It's more of a medieval manor house which been adapted and changed. So the great thing about Kimbolton is, although it's a largely late 17th century, early 18th century building, everything is actually still built on that medieval footprint, which means that we have got more of a direct connection with Catherine than perhaps you might think when you just look at the building when you come in. And, of course, when Vanborough redesigned the castle in the second stage of the great rebuilding, he was very, very keen to sort of look back in terms of the. The history and heritage of the castle. So that's why it's got this castle air. That's why we've got these. These fake towers and battlements deliberately put there by Vanbrugh as a reference back to Kim Bolton's long history, rather than a. A house, perhaps like Blenheim palace, which he just created from scratch.
[00:11:14] Speaker C: Yeah, right. Okay. I kind of.
I kind of catapulted us forward into the 1500s, but actually there's a few hundred years in between there, which I think is useful just to say who owned it, because there was a couple of very significant owners of the castle.
[00:11:28] Speaker D: Yes, yes. So the. The Stafford family owned it. Quite a lot of work was done there with Dukes of Buckingham, but they fell out with the monarchy and therefore, then the castle came into the hands of the Wingfield family in the 1520s. And that's quite important, really, because some history books about Kimbolton give the impression that it was sort of a bit of a ruin, but it wasn't a ruin, because we will see as we go around the castle, there are elements of the castle which dates from the 1520s. So bits of the castle which would be comparatively new are only sort of 14, 15 years old. When Catherine came here, clearly it wasn't necessarily the sort of palatial houses that she'd been used to in her youth, but it wasn't a situation where there was no roof or it was in a state of massive decay.
[00:12:32] Speaker C: Yeah. And I think Chapuys would probably agree with you wholeheartedly, because we do have a letter from him dated 14 May of that year. He's clearly getting intelligence about Catherine's new new lodgings, and he states she is better lodged than she was at Bookton, although the house is small. So, as you quite rightly point out. No, Hampton Court was Kimbolton Castle, but it was preferable. And it was also further from the dreaded Fens, I think.
[00:12:59] Speaker D: Yes.
[00:12:59] Speaker C: Which went down well with Catherine, because as we pointed out at Buckton, she'd already developed a troublesome cough.
[00:13:05] Speaker D: Yes.
[00:13:06] Speaker C: By this stage. And she probably knew her health was a little bit precarious.
[00:13:11] Speaker E: Yes.
[00:13:11] Speaker D: I think that's quite a good reason why talk about Huntingdonshire rather than Cambridgeshire. I think it gives it a more precise geographical location, whereas obviously, when you think about Cambridgeshire, it does include elements of the Fen. So we're definitely not Fenland people in Kimbolton.
[00:13:29] Speaker C: Right, okay, great. Okay, great. Now, I am. One of the beautiful things about, I think, Kimbolton is you mentioned the Duke of Buckingham, who of course was attained and subsequently executed in 1521 for treason. And I think around then. And there may have been also another inventory taken. So we do get a little bit of a feel in writing, a contemporary source telling us what was here. So I wondered if you could perhaps read that out for us.
Thank you.
[00:13:59] Speaker D: There are lodgings and offices for keeping a duke's house in stately manner.
But by occasion of the old mantel wall, the hall there is well built, is likely to perish, although the said castle is and will be in great decay by occasion, there is no reparations done.
Outside the moat is a convenient room for a base court, now used like a grass court. In it there is a fair barn and goodly houses fit for stables.
[00:14:28] Speaker C: Thank you so much. So we start to get a little bit of an idea. This was before, I think, Wingfield came along and plowed the money in that.
[00:14:35] Speaker D: You were talking about. I think that's the quote which I think some historians have used in the past to perhaps over embellish the decaying surroundings that Catherine was placed in. So, yeah, I think it's important, say, although it's not absolutely palatial, it's not a wreck or a ruin either.
[00:15:00] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:15:01] Speaker C: And then we've got John Leyland, who actually describes the house as double dyke, which is the sort of double courtyard with the double moat and building of it meatly strong.
And that Sir Richard Wingfield had built fair new galleries and lodgings upon the foundation of the old castle.
[00:15:17] Speaker D: Absolutely, yes.
[00:15:18] Speaker C: So that's absolutely what you were saying. It had been modernized. So when Catherine came here, probably in a pretty decent state.
[00:15:26] Speaker D: Yes, yes. And it had a bit of TLC in the previous 15 years. I think that's probably the best way to describe it.
[00:15:34] Speaker C: Do you have any sense of why they chose Kimbolton as the place that she was brought to after Buckton?
[00:15:42] Speaker D: Well, I think there are perhaps several reasons. I think it's a bit out of the way. I think that's perhaps quite important, perhaps in terms of the historical context, obviously there's quite a lot of resistance to het Henry VIII's religious policies by this stage. And Buckton's much closer to the main arterial routes to the north.
And in 1536, you're going to have the Pilgrimage of Grace. So actually, having Catherine slightly less accessible is obviously a plus point, I think, as far as the royal authorities are concerned.
[00:16:18] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, See that. I hadn't thought of that before, but you're right, you've got the Catholic north. Yes, very accessible down the Great North Road, which, as we saw in our last episode, runs literally outside the front door of Buckthorn Palace.
[00:16:31] Speaker D: Yes, yes. And obviously the Wingfield family were probably trying to be ingratiating themselves with the King, but I think that's the reason. Obviously, as you said, it was a bit of a compromise.
I suppose they might have preferred Somersham, but Catherine was prepared, rightly so, to dig her heels on occasion.
[00:16:55] Speaker C: Absolutely.
So we arrive at May 1534 and actually out with Kimbolton. This is a seismic month for the crown because we have the act of Succession finally passed by Parliament.
And also at the same time, we have a judgment from the Vatican. Perhaps, Andrew, you could talk to us about the act of Succession, what that was all about and what that meant in practice for people, and then maybe touch on this ruling from the Vatican and what that might have meant, or not meant for poor Catherine.
[00:17:34] Speaker D: Yes. So really what we've got, the act of Succession, is important in that Mary is removed from the succession. So it's a sort of a full triumph for the faction of Anne Boleyn, essentially in a reaffirmation that Catherine is simply the Princess Dowager. So it's the end of the road, really, as far as Catherine's concerned in Britain. And you've got, by contrast, a situation where Rome is ruling in her favor, but without any ability to put that ruling into practice. So it's a bit of a Pyrrhic victory for Catherine. So she's actually won as far as the Rome is concerned. But Rome, by this stage, as far as the English Crown is concerned, is completely out of the equation.
[00:18:33] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:18:33] Speaker C: But you can imagine Catherine, with her deep religious piety and a conviction to her Catholic faith, feeling that this somehow was a moral victory for her and had kind of justified her stance. And her refusal to use anything but Queen in terms of the title and to back down in any way in the sight of the, literally, the bullying, really, that went on.
[00:18:55] Speaker D: I mean. I mean, it does show Catherine to be a very strong and in many ways quite attractive historical figure. And, of course, I think that the problem with Catherine is one tends to sort of talk about her sort of last few years, etcetera, In a negative way and that she's the wrong woman. But obviously, in terms of the 25 years where she'd been in the. In the country, she'd actually proven to be a remarkably successful consort to Henry VIII, as seen in 1513, when she was, you know, effectively directing the operation against the Scots. And I think that's why she was quite respected. So if she'd have been very unpopular, they wouldn't have been so much worried about Catherine being in Buckdham because she was popular and controversial and perhaps got the morality on her side, meant that probably they were more likely to want her to put her in a place like Kim Bolton, far away from crying the way.
[00:22:12] Speaker C: So on the back of this in May, and I think she was probably here by the time this happened. Some of the dates in the letters and papers are a bit confusing, but I think according to Chapuy, she'd probably been here about a week when this happened. On 21st May, 1534, a meeting took place here and Archbishops Lee and Tunstall were sent north by Henry, of course, to reinforce to Catherine her new place in.
[00:22:45] Speaker B: In the.
[00:22:45] Speaker C: In the hierarchy of life. And I'm going to read an extract here from a letter dated 21 May, written by the Archbishop of York, who was. Who was at this meeting.
And he said, we came to declare to her the effect of our commission, that One, you had often sent me and others of her council to declare to her the invalidity of your marriage with her. Yours mean, of course, Henry.
Two, that carnal knowledge, which is the great key of the matter, is sufficiently proved in the law and admitted by some of her counsel.
Three, that on proof of this, you and she were divorced, that she was thereupon admonished to give up the name of Queen and not account herself your wife.
Five, that you had contracted a new marriage with your dearest wife, Queen Anne and six, that as fair issue is already sprung from this marriage and more likely to follow.
Parliament has made acts for the succession and against all that would impugn it.
So apparently, according to this letter, Catherine was pretty incandescent, as you might imagine, and she batted away each of these points with great choler and agony, always interrupting our words, reported the same commissioners. You can only just imagine it, can't you, Andrew?
[00:24:12] Speaker D: Yeah. It must be very difficult working here, though. If you, if you referred to, to Catherine as Queen, you're likely to be in deep trouble. And of course, if you refer to Catherine as a Princess Dowager, she's not going to have anything to do with you. So I think that's one of the reasons why she might have confined herself to her rooms rather than going around the castle as a whole. Because I think you're right, the question what she should be referred to was not it's not a nicety, but it's actually central to her case, isn't it?
[00:24:45] Speaker C: It's absolutely central. And she, and as we heard at Bookden, many of her household were dismissed because they absolutely refused, thinking that they were perjuring themselves by referring to as Princess Dowager. So they were all dismissed except a couple of her ladies and the three men, I think it was the apothecary, the doctor and the confessor, who were all Spaniards and spoke in Spanish. But you're coming onto a really, really good point about the fact that she really, even though she wasn't technically a prisoner, she really behaved as if she was one. And it was kind of, as you said, it was a point of principle. Perhaps you could just talk a little bit more about that for us.
[00:25:30] Speaker D: Well, yes, I mean, we've been talking about the act of Succession and we're talking about the rulings from Rome. So the title is absolutely critical as far as that is concerned. Particularly as we've been listening to a few minutes ago, you got a situation where the King is insisting that there is this carnal relationship between her and Arthur. And again, that is impugning on Catherine's honor, which is so important for her. So it's a big political issue, but there's a very delicate personal dimension here as well, which is so important.
And she's very much the wronged woman in this position. And this is why I think she comes out as a very attractive political figure. So I don't think there are many people who are really prepared to stand up to Henry viii and he's expecting in a sort of a trump style manner that people would be to roll over in that situation.
[00:26:36] Speaker C: And in fact, it was very brave because on the back of that act of Parliament, it became a matter of treason, really.
[00:26:44] Speaker D: Absolutely.
[00:26:44] Speaker C: To speak out against, actually to call her queen. So going back to your point, very dangerous for those people around her to refer to her in that way and, you know, the, and to accept anything other than the marriage of Henry to, to.
To Anne.
[00:27:00] Speaker D: Yes.
[00:27:01] Speaker C: So very, very delicate. But she did, as you point out, look, literally almost lock herself in a chamber. She didn't use the whole castle.
[00:27:08] Speaker D: No, she didn't. No, no. I mean, there's some suggestions she was worried about being poisoned.
But yeah, we think that where her chambers were, that there'd been a newly constructed long gallery, so she could have actually exercised.
And though it was a comparatively small building, but she to a large extent confined herself to one particular area of the castle, apart from going into the chapel, which we'll see later.
[00:27:43] Speaker C: Now I wonder whether we can maybe go, because we're outside at the moment. We've been enjoying a beautiful sunny day as we've been recording this. Maybe we could go around to the side of the building that would have been where her chambers would have been and we can pick up a really kind of rather entertaining and amusing, amusing anecdote from Catherine's time here.
[00:28:02] Speaker E: Okay.
[00:29:19] Speaker C: So, Andrew, we've come round to this side of the building. We on the south side.
[00:29:24] Speaker D: We are on the south side, yes.
[00:29:26] Speaker C: Which is actually what you normally expect with privy apartments. They often face the south because, of course, that's where the sun was. So you've got the best. The best light.
[00:29:35] Speaker D: Absolutely.
[00:29:37] Speaker C: So here we are. Now, am I right in saying we would have been standing in a moat?
[00:29:41] Speaker D: Yes, yes.
Luckily it's dried out at this stage. You're okay, don't need your wellies on. On this occasion. Yes.
[00:29:50] Speaker C: And tell us what we can see at the moment and then maybe an idea, if we could, of what we might have seen back in 1534.
[00:29:58] Speaker D: Yeah. Well, what, what you're seeing now is the fantastic wing of Kimbolton Castle, which was designed by Vanborough and Hawksmoor.
So the present building that you see now on this side dates from the first decade of the 18th century.
The Kimbolton Castle was rebuilt in 2000 stages between the 1690s and 1710. 1720.
But when Catherine here, there would been a. A big round tower here on our right hand. Right hand, right hand side, which, which, which fell down in the 1690s, hence Vanborough being brought in to reconstruct it.
We think that the changes which Wingfield are brought in. So the.
The main part of the castle which is directly in front of me that would have been converted into a long gallery.
[00:31:00] Speaker C: Ah right.
[00:31:00] Speaker D: And then on the left hand side here this is where Catherine's chambers would have been.
[00:31:08] Speaker C: So her private chambers.
[00:31:10] Speaker D: Private chambers there which, which would be adjacent to the chapel so she would be able to worship and think about all the misfortunes we should overtook her in the last 10 years. So yes so it's very much. It's a relatively big building today. Not as big as obviously the buildings in. In London or in Spain but we've got Catherine very much confined to a small section of the castle as a whole.
[00:31:39] Speaker C: Yeah And I think that's one of the beauties of it because. And we will be going inside in a moment dear. Listen to be in the room very rooms where Catherine died. So I think that's the fact that those spaces still survive even though they've been changed is really wonderful.
[00:31:51] Speaker D: Yeah. And. And the key thing is that Vanborough when he rebuilt the.
Rebuilt the castle as I said before he wanted to as a nod to the path. So although it's a 18th century building we've got the towers and the battlements to show Kim Bolton's heritage lasting several hundred years and not something which just suddenly appeared out of the blue in the 1690s.
[00:32:15] Speaker C: I tell you what, I haven't asked you. Do we know if the original house or the Tudor house was built of brick or was it stone? Do we know what it would have actually looked like?
[00:32:25] Speaker D: I think that there are some brick elements but I think it's a combination of the two to be honest. I know that later on that some of the stone which was used was from Higham Ferris Castle which was being got rid of. So yes, I know Simon Thurlay's illustration indicates it to be mainly brick but because it's so old I'm not quite sure how much brick was material being used in the late medieval period. So I think it's probably slightly hodgepodge because the cast has always evolved over time rather than starting from scratch.
[00:33:08] Speaker C: Yeah. Because you can imagine Richard Winfield in the 15 late 15 teens before he died in. When did he die? 1524, something like that. He would have known Hampton Court so I suspect he was going to try and do something in red brick but it'd be interesting to know.
[00:33:26] Speaker D: But certainly the Tudor windows we'll see later on are of stone and stone.
[00:33:32] Speaker C: Okay. Right now I did promise a little kind of Funny story and it's sort of poignant in a way because here we have Catherine shut away from. She's exiled from court, she's not allowed to see her daughter, she's lost all her beloved ladies except two who she didn't really want. They were obviously not her favourites. We know that from letters written at Buckden and she's, she's really got no friends here, she's really isolated. But there are two staunch supporters of Catherine who were determined to see her and perhaps you could tell us a little bit about those. And then I, I've got fairly long quote from a passage from a letter from Chapuy that I think is worth reading in full because it really gives us some beautiful detail about a light hearted moment.
[00:34:20] Speaker D: Yes, yes. Well, the, the two are Maria de Salinas and Chapuy. So Chapui, obviously the Spanish ambassador, very, very keen to champion Catherine's cause and despite the fact he was regularly refused admission to see Catherine, was very, very persistent and obviously eventually succeeded in visiting her here just before she died.
[00:34:49] Speaker C: Yeah, we'll talk a little bit more about that six successful visit because I'm going to come on to an unsuccessful visit at the moment and the same with Maria. She eventually got in right at the end.
[00:34:59] Speaker D: She did, she did, yes. But both of them showed tremendous loyalty and persistence because it was something that Henry VIII was determined to stop. Really?
[00:35:10] Speaker C: Absolutely.
[00:35:11] Speaker D: I think he's trying to break Catherine's spirit and so eventually she will, what you would say, bow to the inevitable and I can accept the act of Succession.
[00:35:23] Speaker C: Yeah.
So let me come to that story because I do enjoy this story. It's one of my favorites and I love the fact that Chapuy, as ever inveterate gossip of court has managed to leave us with such a vivid picture. Went on in July. So this is two months after she was being here. So apparently he set off from London with great, in a great train of people. He made a.
An ostentatious distinction display that he was heading out to see Catherine. He wanted as many people to see him as possible.
So he, this is in his own words. I set out with about 60 horses, both of my own men and of certain Spanish merchants here to visit the Queen. And it happened most conveniently for my purpose that the way lay through the whole length of London.
So he's basically going. Yeah.
On the second day a messenger on horseback riding at full speed went before us and returned afterwards to where I lay accompanied by an honest man sent by the Queen's chamberlain and steward. To inform me that they had received commands by the said messenger not to let me enter where the queen was or to speak with her.
My answer was that I did not intend to displease the king, either in this or in anything else, but that, considering the solicitations I had made, to know the king's intentions in this matter, so he had obviously made a lot of attempts and been ignored, and that I had come within five miles of where the queen was, I would not return so lightly.
Next day, early in the morning, another man came to us of more authority than the first, saying that they did not think it advisable that I should come to the house or even pass through the village.
One of Catherine's chamber gave me to understand that although she did not dare to declare it, he knew well she would have great pleasure if part of the company were to present themselves before the place, which they did the next day, to the great consolation, as it seems, of the ladies who spoke to them from the battlements and the windows. And it seemed to the country.
It seemed to the country people that the Messiah had come.
However, that's not the end of the story because there's a very funny little bit here. So this is according to the Spanish Chronicle, so a different source, it said that Catherine's ladies appeared at the window. Windows and battlements, as we know. And a very quote, very funny young fellow, a fool, I presume.
[00:37:51] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:37:51] Speaker C: Jumped down from his horse and waded waist deep into the moat, crying out that he longed to reach them.
When he feigned drowning, he was pulled from the water, ripping a padlock. Padlock. Off his hood and hurling it towards the ladies, crying out in Spanish, take this, and next time I will bring the key. And apparently, there was a lot of hilarity that ensued, and the Spanish entourage were offered food in the lower hall before returning to debrief the Spanish ambassador. So, great story.
[00:38:24] Speaker D: A fantastic story. Yes.
[00:38:25] Speaker C: We're standing in the moat.
[00:38:26] Speaker D: We're standing in the moat. Yes. Yes. I'm afraid I haven't got any padlocks.
[00:38:31] Speaker C: No, you can't help.
[00:38:32] Speaker D: No, no.
[00:38:33] Speaker C: Okay, fine. But it's interesting. You may know this. If they went to the lower hall.
I was wondering whether that's your.
I think there was. There's another account that. I think it's the history of the county of Huntingdon that suggests that might be the Whitehall and what do you know thing.
[00:38:51] Speaker D: Yes, it definitely would be the White Hole, and we can have a look at that later. Yeah.
[00:38:56] Speaker C: Should we go in? Actually, yes.
[00:38:58] Speaker D: I think they're relying the floor at the moment, so we're lucky. We might actually be able to see some of the original stone floor. But anyway. Yeah, that's the. The wire.
[00:39:07] Speaker C: Let's go.
It.
So we've now come inside as people will be able to hear, the acoustics have changed completely. And of course, you can see there are no Tudor interiors left here. But we are in that hall. You're telling me, where the Spanish.
[00:41:37] Speaker D: Yes, yes. So this is the original great hall.
We're now in what's called the red room, which is next to the white hall. But in Tudor times, this red room as well will form part of the great hall.
There would be a flag floor as well.
And we've got here a painting of the children of the 4th Earl of Manchester, but beneath that there was found a inscription of a bible from the 1530s.
[00:42:15] Speaker C: Oh, wow.
[00:42:16] Speaker D: And I want a photograph of that.
[00:42:19] Speaker A: I could.
[00:42:19] Speaker C: Oh, could you leave that with us?
[00:42:21] Speaker D: Yes. So it's when the picture was being cleaned a few years ago.
[00:42:28] Speaker C: I wonder what else is behind all this paneling.
[00:42:30] Speaker D: Absolutely. Well, we've got a little bit of original wall here.
[00:42:35] Speaker C: So we just turned. Literally turned around. And so what's happening here? Is this just something that you were having some renovations and you've left that glass panel?
[00:42:42] Speaker D: Yes, it just gives an indication of what it looked like. It's a very good. Very good illustration of the fact that although everything looks very 18th century, beneath the facade, we've still got the elements of the medieval building.
[00:43:00] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:43:00] Speaker C: Because you can see the medieval stonework.
It's not the same as the beautiful polished Georgia.
[00:43:05] Speaker D: No, absolutely. And we'll see more of that when we go downstairs. But they said the wife. So in terms of the footprint of the castle. So you come in here through the drawbridge. Port Collis.
Yeah. In the gate. And you come into the courtyard, up the steps to the great hall. So, as I say, it's all very late 17th, early 18th century, but it's very much on that sort of medieval footprint.
[00:43:38] Speaker C: Okay, great. So before we go to the part of the castle where Catherine. Catherine's chambers were, maybe we could go and have a look at that. The original bits of the Tudor bit you've still got. Because I think this would be a good time to just go. And while we're talking about a little bit of walls and architecture, let's go do that.
[00:44:01] Speaker D: These are the original sections here. We've also got this, which has been repaired, but this was just to give you indication which is all just They've just found.
[00:44:13] Speaker C: Oh, right, okay.
[00:44:14] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:44:15] Speaker C: This is the. This is. Yeah, I see what you mean.
It's mostly stone, isn't it? Probably we've patched in with bits of the new bits that ringfield came along. Might have been in stone in.
[00:44:27] Speaker D: Yeah, it's mainly.
Mainly stone, yeah. Yeah. So. So we've got two.
Sorry, two windows. This was. This was. This is. This is earlier, but this one is the. Is the one. There's the wing feel. One interesting piece of brick here.
[00:44:44] Speaker C: Yeah.
That looks like it was a doorway, isn't it?
[00:44:47] Speaker D: Originally, Basically, when they put the Pellegrini staircase on, they. They.
This would originally gone onto the courtyard. So this is from the 1520s, right?
[00:44:58] Speaker C: Yeah. So it is stone. It is mostly stone, isn't it?
[00:45:02] Speaker D: And it was all rediscovered about 1980 because it was all plasterboard. So I just had one of the history teachers sort of messing around with some of the students and discovered all this. People discovered this.
[00:45:17] Speaker C: How fantastic. I'd love to discover something like that. It'd be so exciting.
[00:45:22] Speaker D: Okay. I've also got a few doorways here from Catherine's time as well.
[00:45:28] Speaker C: Oh, yes.
[00:45:29] Speaker D: And one behind you.
[00:45:30] Speaker C: Yes, absolutely. Can't miss a good old Tudor doorway, can you?
Do you think this would have been into the courtyard then, originally?
[00:45:39] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:45:40] Speaker C: So this. This has been added on.
[00:45:42] Speaker D: This has been added on.
[00:45:43] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:45:44] Speaker D: We're above the pellet reef. So what they did was when they redid it, they tried to disguise the fact that this part of the courtyard. Because this has been put on.
[00:45:57] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:45:57] Speaker D: Is actually smaller than the other. So if you look at the number of bricks here, the number of bricks between these two windows is less than the number of bricks.
[00:46:08] Speaker C: Okay, Right.
[00:46:09] Speaker D: But when you turn around, of course, you've got three windows on one side and three and a half.
[00:46:14] Speaker C: Yeah, right.
Yes. They've just moved it in.
[00:46:17] Speaker D: Yes.
[00:46:19] Speaker C: Oh, you see this everywhere, don't you? These how they took the old houses and just put facades on them or added. Added, you know, brought the wing out.
[00:46:26] Speaker D: Absolutely fabulous. Fantastic.
[00:46:27] Speaker C: Aren't they gorgeous?
[00:46:29] Speaker D: They're supposed to be better than the ones at Hampton Court.
[00:46:31] Speaker C: They are beautiful.
[00:46:32] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:46:33] Speaker C: When do they. They date from the Bamborough period as well, do they?
[00:46:37] Speaker D: 1690.
[00:46:38] Speaker C: Oh, okay, right, lovely.
[00:46:40] Speaker D: But they're not always terribly effective. So they've actually damaged some of the paintings in the chapel.
[00:46:47] Speaker C: Oh, I see.
[00:46:48] Speaker D: And the brick is a very strange quality. Some of it's extremely fine.
[00:46:52] Speaker C: Right.
[00:46:53] Speaker D: And some of it's a little bit dodgy.
[00:46:56] Speaker C: Right, okay.
Right. Okay.
[00:46:58] Speaker D: So we'd like to go to study now and then finish up in the chapel.
[00:47:02] Speaker C: Yeah, exactly that.
So, Andrew, we've come inside into one of, I think, you know, the most poignant places associated with this story. So tell us about where we are now.
[00:47:53] Speaker D: Well, we're now in what is the headmaster's study, but more importantly, it's known as the Queen's Room. So this is where Catherine Varaghan did die on the 7th of January, 1536.
[00:48:08] Speaker C: Wow. So these were her privy chambers, adjacent, as you said, to a gallery where she could have taken exercise.
[00:48:15] Speaker D: Yes, yes, yes, the long gallery, which we think would have been constructed by Wingfield. So a comparatively new long gallery. And clearly in this room you've got a scene from Shakespeare's Henry VIII set in this room. And then you've also Hilary Mantel talking about Kim Bolton in her book Bringing up the Bodies as well. So it's got sort of all sorts of wonderful, wonderful references.
[00:48:50] Speaker C: Yeah, I mean, we're really privileged to be here today because obviously this isn't a public space normally, unfortunately, because I know there would be many people who are listening who would love to come and stand in these rooms.
[00:49:02] Speaker D: So we are. We are open twice a year for the public and the first Sunday in October and the first Sunday in March.
So if you wanted to come to Kimbolton, very welcome to book tickets on those occasions. And we do do private tours as well.
[00:49:22] Speaker C: Well, that's worthwhile, really worthwhile knowing. So, I mean, we will come back at the end and just make sure that we've got all the kind of details about how people and when people can visit, but it's really great to know that.
So we're now in December of 1535. So Catherine's been here at Kimbolton about a year and a half and we've already said that this persistent cough suggests that she was developing some kind of chronic illness.
But we start to get. By December, she really starts to become very unwell.
And again, we have details through Ambassador Chapuy when he's writing to Charles V two days after her death, actually, about her final illness.
And he states that, quote, it began about five weeks ago as then I wrote to your majesty, and the attack was renewed on the morrow of Christmas Day.
It was a pain in the stomach so violent that she could not retain food and that being unable to eat or sleep, except so little that it might be called nothing, she was so wasted that she could not support herself either on her feet or sitting in bed. So quite a sorry state, by the End.
But she did have the comfort of two visitors who we've already mentioned. Perhaps you could tell us a little bit more about their actual visit, when they finally got to see her, when did they come and what do we know of those visits?
[00:51:00] Speaker D: So, yes, she's in a deteriorating condition. We think it's stomach cancer that she had. And it's very much in the case of the last few weeks that both Chapuys and Maria de Salinas are able to come to Kimbolton. I don't think Chapuis is there at the end.
[00:51:22] Speaker B: That's right.
[00:51:23] Speaker C: He's here until, I think, the 31st. Because he actually does say improving a bit. That she was improving. He said.
He said. I think she. He arrived on New Year's Eve and He stayed for four days and he left on the 4th of January, because, as he said, I took leave of her on the Tuesday evening, which was the 4th of January, leaving her very cheerful.
And that evening I saw her laugh two or three times.
And about half an hour after I left her, she desired to have some pastime with one of the men. Ki fait du pleasant.
[00:51:56] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:51:56] Speaker D: It's almost as though she'd been isolated here for such a long time. She didn't have any real friends or proper confidants. So perhaps the visitation of people like Chapuy was sort of psychologically uplifted for her, but perhaps Chapuy didn't necessarily have that knowledge or ability to see through that. The fact that she was improving because she had that human contact rather than there was a physical improvement.
And I suppose the thing is, when you have got visitors in this particular situation, you tend to put on your sort of public face, don't you? And therefore you try and seem sort of grateful for the visits, try and seem to be a little bit. A little bit more optimistic. So I think.
I think real Chapuy is sort of almost allowed himself to be deceived. Do you think he might be sort of slightly guilty? The fact that he. He wasn't there when Catherine died, and therefore, perhaps wanting to create a slightly more optimistic view of her situation, because obviously, if you're reporting back to the King of Spain, you've gone to all this trouble to be at Kimbolton and then suddenly she dies within a couple of days of you leaving. It doesn't necessarily look good, does it?
[00:53:34] Speaker C: Yeah, it's interesting because also sometimes, I mean, I think this is a phenomenon that people do rally before they die.
[00:53:40] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:53:41] Speaker C: And I wonder whether that's what happened with Catherine. Also bolstered, as you say, the kind of balm for the soul of seeing two of her oldest and dearest friends.
And we know that Maria de Salinas had managed to charm her way into the castle and basically sat with Catherine talking to her in her native castle, Castilian tongue. And so I do wonder whether it was a combination of, you say, as that kind of psychological boost, but also that phenomenon, that sort of principle.
[00:54:11] Speaker D: Yes, I suppose with those two dear friends, she's more at peace with herself, isn't she? So she's able to articulate her feelings where perhaps there hasn't been anybody really who she felt she could articulate those most private of feelings as somebody who's. People who've been with her. And the journey. There's a very 21st century way of describing it, sort of the journey that she'd been on in the past decade or so. That must have been old friends. Yeah, old friends. Old friends.
[00:54:47] Speaker C: I mean, she had her confessor, of course, but that's a bit different to having old friends by your side.
[00:54:54] Speaker D: Confess is very sort of specific, isn't it, Rather than sort of ranging in terms of perhaps the incidents in your life, perhaps those. Perhaps funny incidents which might. Might have happened.
[00:55:08] Speaker C: Exactly.
[00:55:08] Speaker D: But certainly getting that reference back to the life you previously had is probably psychologically quite.
[00:55:16] Speaker E: Quite interesting.
[00:55:18] Speaker D: But it's.
[00:55:19] Speaker E: Yeah, but it's a extremely sad.
[00:55:23] Speaker D: And obviously, I suppose that she. One thing she would have desired was for Mary to be able to have come here. So I'm sure.
[00:55:31] Speaker C: I'm sure she also passed some messages through Maria de Salinas to take back to Mary, probably some letters as well, that we no longer know about. But there was is one letter we do know about. There is, and that is a letter, of course, that Catherine wrote, one of her last letters, certainly her final letter to her husband as she saw him. And you're going to read that out for us in full?
[00:55:55] Speaker D: Yes.
[00:55:57] Speaker E: My most dear Lord King and husband, the hour of my death now drawing on the tender love I owe you, forces me, my case being such, to commend myself to you and to put you in remembrance with a few words of the health and safeguard of your soul, which you ought to prefer before all worldly matters and before the care and pampering of your body, for the which you have cast me into many calamities and yourself into many troubles.
For my part, I pardon you everything I wish to devoutly pray God he will pardon you also.
For the rest, I commend unto you our daughter Mary.
Beseeching you to be a good father unto her, as I have hitherto desired, I entreat you also, on behalf of my maids, to give them marriage portions, which is not much, there being but three.
For all my other servants, I solicit the wages due to them and a year more, lest they be unprovided for.
Lastly, I make this vow that mine eyes desire you above all things.
Catherine the Queen.
[00:57:23] Speaker C: I've got real shivers going down my spine because I can almost hear her voice echoing over yours.
[00:57:29] Speaker D: Yes.
[00:57:30] Speaker C: Dictating those words as one of her ladies.
[00:57:33] Speaker D: Yes.
[00:57:33] Speaker E: And it's a very good summary, really, of not only her feeling, but of.
[00:57:41] Speaker D: Her character, that she is thinking of others in a most sort of a.
[00:57:46] Speaker E: Desperate time, and for herself. And of course, that she's saying she.
[00:57:52] Speaker D: Loves Henry viii, but she's making it absolutely clear where she stands that she's right and he's wrong, and especially when about the care and pampering of your body. That's quite a very sort of direct criticism, isn't it? Something which I don't think Henry VIII was quite used to.
[00:58:15] Speaker C: No, indeed. But for me, the line that is just Catherine, through and through is Catherine the Queen. She's still saying, basically, up yours. Yes, I'm putting two fingers up. I'm still the Queen.
[00:58:30] Speaker D: Yes, I'm still the Queen. And with my clothing. You can't undo the word of God.
[00:58:35] Speaker E: As far as she's concerned.
[00:58:37] Speaker C: Exactly. So, yes, my friends, Maria died in this very space at 2pm on Friday 7th January in 1536.
And I think, interestingly, as was usually the case, of course, her body was.
There was this secret autopsy that was. That was done on her before, and her body was then embalmed and moved to the chapel. Now, this is, for me, one of the next really interesting parts of this story, because when I was writing my chapter on Kimbolton for In the Footsteps of the Six Wives, I had no idea till I came here that the chapel's still here.
[00:59:19] Speaker D: Yes, it is, yes.
[00:59:21] Speaker C: And that actually it connects. These rooms connect to the chapel. So I wonder if we could just walk where Catherine would have walked and then really complete our story by talking.
[00:59:34] Speaker E: About what happened there. Absolutely, yes.
[00:59:36] Speaker D: So, well, it's just a few steps away to the chapel, which is still used on a regular occasion. Indeed. I got married there in 1999.
[00:59:45] Speaker C: Oh, did you?
[00:59:46] Speaker B: Wonderful.
[00:59:47] Speaker C: I love that. I love that. So, yeah, we're going to go there. And I think this is one of these spaces that is small enough to make you feel. Feel the presence of history.
[01:00:00] Speaker D: Yes.
[01:00:00] Speaker C: Around you with the way.
[01:00:01] Speaker B: Lead the way.
[01:00:02] Speaker D: You are supposed to be able to see her ghost here as well.
[01:00:04] Speaker C: Yes, I have her. But you haven't yet.
[01:00:06] Speaker D: No. But the knee, when you can, you only see from the knees upwards because of the level of floor.
[01:00:10] Speaker E: Since 1536. Yeah.
[01:00:12] Speaker B: I still haven't.
[01:00:13] Speaker C: I. I've only been here twice. I still haven't seen her yet either.
Let's head out.
[01:00:22] Speaker D: There's a local candle maker embalm her, didn't he?
[01:00:26] Speaker C: So. Yes. So she was. There was a. There's a quote here from the letters and papers saying that the provision was made for the bowling coring and enclosing of the corpse in lead and that lights and other things should be put about the corpse in the house or in the next church or chapel. Now, you pointed out literally there was a way for Catherine to just come out of her privy chamber, a few short steps and into the gallery that looked down onto the body.
[01:01:03] Speaker D: Absolutely. Absolutely, yes.
So she would been very much in the chapel, able to pray on a very regular basis. And it's very important that because. Because she's not having to go through the rest of the house, she's not having to go through the village.
So that sort of intimacy with God and that sort of belief in salvation can be very much one of the reasons why she. Particularly why Kimbolton might have been a better place for her in the sense that the closeness to the chapel and her lodgings was perhaps, you know, very much emphasized. I don't know how it compared to Buckton in that sense.
[01:01:53] Speaker C: There was, and it was quite a small connected inter connection of great hall, great chamber and chapel there. Unfortunately, chapel has completely gone. It's a very modern replacement now, but we're in. Can you describe the chapel? I will say, of course, course we're going to put images of the chapel as all the other things in our show notes page, but it's clearly not the interiors that Catherine would have seen.
[01:02:20] Speaker D: No, but it's in the same place. It's in the corner of the. Of the courtyard and it's facing the west front of the. Of the castle.
So the. The chapel as we see now is from the 1690s and with an addition by Vambrough in the first decade of the 18th century. The interesting thing is that the west front of the castle is not straight and this presented a problem because Vanbrugh wanted the.
The chapel to have those proportions. So you can see we've got little gallery here. And the gallery narrows to reflect the fact that the west front is not straight.
And so what we've got, we've got a nice copy of a painting by Catherine near the altar. Then we've got these fantastic works by the Venetian artist Pellegrini, who came to Kimbolt and work.
Worked with Vanbrugh. Worked with Vanbrugh also at the Haymarket Theatre in London.
So we've got the Transfiguration here.
Unfortunately, I don't know whether something went wrong with the proportion, because Christ appears to be holding up the ceiling at a particular point in time.
And we've also got the four Evangelists, but again, we've got a slight problem. We've got these fantastic drain pipes at Kimbolton, but not terribly useful. So we've actually got one of the evangelists. The painting had to be changed and it was a local clergyman who changed it, but unfortunately he got things wrong. So we've got one of the apostles looking in the wrong direction in comparison. And so when the Manchesters were here, this. This chapel very much reflected the social status.
So if you. We're here now in the bottom of the chapel, so this is where the maids, the butlers, would come for worship. If you're a member of the Manchester family, you'd be upstairs on the balcony, and if you were one of the estate workers, you'd have to stand at the back beneath the balcony. So the Manchesters wouldn't even have to look at their state workers when they came to the chapel. And the chapel is still used by the school on a sort of daily basis, with each house coming to the chapel once a week. And.
Yeah, so it's. And it's just been refurbished. Also got a couple. Couple of war memorials here for pupils killed in the first and Second World War. And then right at the top, we've got a photograph there of Philip Stubbs, who was the first 11 goalkeeper was killed on the Battle of the Somme.
So, yeah, so we got through the. We've got the Catherine connection right the way through to memorials from 1945.
So it's all encapsulated.
And as you rightly said, although the actual chapel itself physically is from the late 17th century, you can trace the fact there has been a chapel on this site right from the medieval period. So we have got that direct connection to Catherine. And we do hold a service here every January. Every January the seventh, have a service to commemorate the life of Catherine of Aragon.
We have readings in Spanish and members of the local community come here every year. So Very proud of our sort of Catherine of Aragon connection.
[01:06:33] Speaker A: Indeed.
[01:06:34] Speaker D: A couple of the buildings from the school are called. The new science block is called the Catherine of Aragon building.
[01:06:43] Speaker C: I love it. I love the fact that actually, I.
[01:06:45] Speaker B: Mean, you're not alone.
[01:06:46] Speaker C: Of course, Peterborough is also Peterborough Cathedral, which we'll be going to next for our final episode, also annually commemorates Catherine. So it's amazing that she's letting left this connection to people and people are still think so highly of her that they want to, 500 years later, still remember her memory.
[01:07:05] Speaker D: Yes.
[01:07:06] Speaker C: But I just wanted to really conclude by saying, literally, we are standing here in the center of the chapel and of course, Catherine's coffin would have rested upon some kind of beer, I think.
[01:07:17] Speaker D: That's right, yes.
[01:07:18] Speaker C: With lighted tapers. We know there were lights, tapers that were kept lighted. And she was here, I think, for about three weeks.
[01:07:25] Speaker D: Yes, she was, she was, yes. And as I said, In 1986, we reenacted the procession from Kimbolton to.
To. To Peterborough via Sortry. So, yeah, so. So, yes, she was, she was. She was here for. For a few weeks.
[01:07:45] Speaker C: And. And I think it's, you know, as I say, I think it's quite amazing. I mean, it's a small space and I'm literally, you know, I'm literally standing next to where Catherine's body would have laid in state. And that's always.
It's kind of very poignant, but it's also a thrill for a history lover to be able to get to kind of be able to pinpoint exactly where things.
[01:08:04] Speaker D: Absolutely.
[01:08:05] Speaker C: And to be able to go and stand there and. And be with your thoughts about that person, particularly if they mean a lot to you and you have that connection to them. And so that really, I think, leads us on. And I'm going to just introduce here our next podcast because after those three weeks, of course, a period of time was required because they had to make lots of preparations at Peterborough for a funeral of a Princess Dowager, a very important royal person.
And hence she was here for that length of. Of time. But it was of course from here that her body was subsequently taken to Peterborough Cathedral. And in fact, that is where we will meet next in our next episode as we pick up the story of Catherine's funeral and interment in the cathedral there.
But before we go, I did just want to come back, Andrew, just to reiterate for people, if they want to visit, what are the best ways for them to. To come and perhaps see some of these spaces for themselves?
[01:09:09] Speaker D: Well, there are two Ways, really. First of all, the castle is open to the public the first Sunday in October and the first Sunday in March, and you can book those tickets on the Kimbolton Castle website.
And the second way, if you're a member of a society or a group, you can contact Kimbolton Castle, Kimbolton School, Kimbolton Enterprises directly. And we're more than happy to take parties of 20 or 30 people round the castle. And we can do sort of a tease afterwards as well. Very nice, but it's. Catherine's an important element, but. But I'll be able to see a sort of a fantastic late Stuart early Georgian building as well.
[01:10:09] Speaker C: Yes, indeed.
[01:10:10] Speaker B: Indeed.
[01:10:11] Speaker C: Well, thank you for that and thank you so much for being my guide today. It's been great. Thank you, Andrew.
[01:10:16] Speaker D: Thank you.
[01:10:19] Speaker B: Well, I hope you enjoyed that. Wow. There are some stories to tell and as you heard, there are some open days at Kimbolton. So if you haven't yet been there, and it is one of those places that's not. Not exactly on the usual tourist trail for Tudor history lovers worldwide, then maybe you want to look at those open days and plan yourself a trip. It is quite a special thing to stand in those rooms where Catherine spent her final days, and possibly even the room itself in which she died, and the chapel, of course, where her body lay in state.
You'll find all the details for finding more about Kim Bolton in the description associated with this podcast.
[01:11:02] Speaker C: So that's it for today.
[01:11:03] Speaker B: We will be back actually at the end of this month because, of course, Catherine was interred at the end of January, and we will release the third and final episode in this trilogy on that day.
[01:11:16] Speaker C: And you'll be hearing all about the.
[01:11:18] Speaker B: Place of her internment, Peterborough Cathedral, and also the stories around her funeral service and what you can see there today.
So keep an eye out for that, because that will take the place of February's podcast. So it's a two in one month this month, and then we return in March.
Keep an eye out for that. And all that remains for me to say is, wherever you are in the world, have a wonderful few weeks. I'll be out and about recording some new podcasts in the freezing cold, no doubt, but looking forward to bringing you more Tudor history stories stories.
[01:12:14] Speaker C: Thank you for tuning in to today's episode of the Tudor History and Travel Show. If you've loved the show, please take a moment to subscribe, like and rate.
[01:12:24] Speaker B: This podcast so that we can spread the Tudor love.
[01:12:28] Speaker C: Until next time, my friends. All that remains for me to say is happy Time traveling, Sam.
